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FOMATPLAY okay Thomas thank you for being here for joining this project. so could you tell us more about your journey? what brought you here in Naples? ANTHANASIOS about mine? FOMATPLAY about your journey, yeah why are you here? ATHANASIOS yes actually I came around a half month ago to become a PhD. At the start... I mean... I was a PhD student for three years in Greece. Yes, before I enrolled here. back in Greece. um yeah that's; so yeah I just saw the call; I applied; um and I'm really glad that I'm here. um yeah FOMATPLAY are you enjoying Naples? ATHANASIOS oh yeah yeah sure. I mean I love Naples. I mean, I've been here just for one month; little bit more, but yeah. I really enjoy life here and the people. everything. the seminars and especially the group with other students; international students; it's it's really good. ATHANASIOS are you planning to stay here also after your PhD? or you're planning to leave? ATHANASIOS oh yeah it depends. I mean, I would love to stay here. I mean, I don't know yet but from what I've seen so far yes. of course I would consider staying here long term. FOMATPLAY okay. Could you tell us more about your PhD? ANTHANASIOS hmm well my PhD is actually on modern European history; um the timespan is around the end of the 19th- the beginning of the 20th century; uh it's a comparative analysis of the socialist historiography uh in Germany, France, Britain and Italy. uh or hope so... uh and um yeah I'm mostly working with uh mythological speaking. I'm working with transnational conceptual history. um and my main sources are historical monographs, socialist and academic historical journals, um also some private correspondences between socialist historians. um that's I think. FOMATPLAY what about your working environment in SSM where you study? ATHANASIOS 02:50:23 well. it's great, I would say. so far. um I mean yes we have a really good working relationship with the rest; with, with a, with a group of students. um okay. I mean we have a lot of readings which is good and bad. it's really nice to read about really different, diverse subjects. would have nothing to do-, which have nothing to do with my PhD. it's interesting. It gives me ideas. um and I I would say that everything is fine. I mean, of course there are some administrative difficulties. um but, yeah. overall I think that the working environment is really good. FOMATPLAY okay could you expand a little bit on your struggles? with bureaucracy here? ATHANASIOS well... In SSM or in general? hmm okay. well, regarding SSM for example, we don't have uh internet access. uh yeah yeah. that's a thing because we need the credentials from the university of Naples from Federico II but our credentials are provided by the SSM and so there is a conflict of... yes but hopefully, I mean, SSM has applied to EDUROAM so everything is gonna be solved sooner or later. um but hopefully I also... I have my previous credentials they haven't canceled from my Univeristy from the university in Greece. so I shared with other students my credentials and we have.... also yeah; and in general okay um I don't think that I have many bureaucratic um problems because I'm a European citizen so it's much easier for me. but I know other people who have serious problems regarding the payments etc. people coming outside of the European opinion; but for me who.... I'm a European citizen; it's simple. hmm yeah FOMATPLAY Ok, you mentioned that you are former PhD student in Greece. um so you already hold a PhD? ATHANASIOS no, no, no. I never finished. Actually it's the same chapter but uh in Greece I didn't have direct funding for my research. I had some kind of scholarship; I had some kind of part time jobs as a research assistant. yeah so there was no way that I was going to finish it in Greece. so yes.... and since I didn't have any direct funding I decided to apply and to start anew here. um okay FOMATPLAY how did you learn about SSM? ATHANASIOS well by chance. because I... when I was in Germany, I was in I was registered in a mailing list of the institute there; The institute for social movements in Boho and I was just yeah received an email through this mailing list and yeah. that's how I Learned about the call and decided to; okay, I have nothing to lose FOMATPLAY okay. which values of Naples were most easy to accommodate with? ATHANASIOS sorry? FOMATPLAY which values or behaviours of Naples did you struggle to acccomodate with and, on the other hand, what are you enjoying of Neapolitan, Italian behaviours in that... ATHANASIOS well. before I had come here I was a little bit nervous about what I was going to find here. yes but yeah because many many people in Greece told me "oh yes it's another world; it's completely different from here; it's not only cultural differences; really..." but when I came-, when I arrived here I realized that okay I mean it is not not that different from from Greece; especially from Athens and so I I don't think I struggle with something. okay of course finding an apartment is is a struggle. but it's not... why? you tell me... no no I can totally understand it. because of airB&B, tourism.... it is the same story in Greece so I can totally get the gentrification. yes but except for that, I really enjoy life. I mean I really enjoy the people that are really open to talk at any time; I have felt welcomed um yeah FOMATPLAY okay do you miss Greece? ATHANASIOS not that much. I mean, I miss my friends for sure; but Greece no. I wouldn't say that I miss Greece. FOMATPLAYlet's talk about a little bit about the freedom of moment within Europe. how would you summarize your experience? ANTHANASIOS hmm well so far great. I mean, FOMATPLAY cause you were mentioning... you lived in Germany. ANTHANASIOS yes, that's true. um I mean... for example, okay. yeah there is freedom of movement, right? we can move with; just with our IDS so it's really easy. of course there are differences. for example in Germany bureaucracy is more organized; more strict; I mean... they have specific rules to follow and everything is okay. here in Naples it's uh.... I'm not sure if this is the case, exactly. um they seem, it seems to me that they are improvising more often than in Germany. um but yeah as of the moving part I think it's.... yeah, I mean; compared to 30 years ago it's much easier I guess. um so... yeah, I don't know what to say. FOMATPLAY um so are you planning to learn Italian? ANTHANASIOS yes yes I'm planning. FOMATPLAY you're thinking of attending courses or learning by experience? ANTHANASIOS ah a little bit of both, I would say. I mean, I would like to begin courses next semester. Umm hmm um I don't know if it is possible but I hope that it will be. uh but either way; I mean, I am also planning to have uh my own courses for myself to just uh... yeah learn by myself actually; because I... that was uh... cause I speak French. Freach and Italian so far it seems to me that they are are really close as languages. so yeah I think that's. FOMATPLAY and how did you learn French? ANTHANASIOS by course. I had courses for two years while I was in Greece and while I was in Germany actually. I had courses online yeah. distant courses. yeah hmm FOMATPLAY okay. Have you ever felt mistreated here in Italy or even in Germany so far? ANTHANASIOS hmm okay. uh personally no. I haven't felt that way in, no. no, never. uh of course I know. of course it is... it depends on what kind of, of activities one is engaged with. I mean; I have... I mostly, you know, work on academic environment which is a kind of a bubble; let's say um socially, politically it's... so no I haven't felt discrimination or yeah. but I know that that's the case for me. but I'm living here in Naples and other students who are not Europeans but they are.... from outside of Europe; it's, it's much more difficult; for example finding an apartment. so it is a.... it is a real problem, it is a real thing. FOMATPLAY and um how... what kind of influence has EU; what do you think about the EU as an institution and status? ANTHANASIOS hmm okay what do I think about the EU? FOMATPLAY yeah and what kind of influence EU has on you? ANTHANASIOS on me? FOMATPLAY as a person on your identity and so on. ANTHANASIOS me as a person... I don't know. I mean... of course uh European Union provides uh a spectrum of possibilities; freedom of uh moving within the European Union, much easier bureaucratic uh processes. um yeah for sure. that's a good one but... um yeah I mean overall um. I'm not so sure. I mean when it comes to politics um I'm not sure. I mean, I'm not sure what European Union does actually. because for example is it uh European integration um but even European integration somehow promotes national inequalities within the European Union. so I think that yeah even if European Union provides many positive things um in terms of practical matters, practical policies... um on the other hand there are some inner contradictions within the European kingdom; and I don't think that they can be solved through through the European Union. I'm not sure about it. FOMATPLAY and how would you define your identity? European? something in between? ANTHANASIOS um no European identity doesn't.... I mean. I'm not sure if it says something to me. um even Greek identity; I'm not sure it say something for me I would say because... okay of course it defines the language we speak or um... but no I don't think that it is that important. I mean the European identity. no okay FOMATPLAY um okay. let's talk about Brexit. uh what kind of memories do you have about that referendum back in 2016? so.... ANTHANASIOS 14:54:20 hmm. memories. FOMATPLAY thoughts? opinions? ANTHANASIOS I don't know. I really don't know about it. I mean um because Greece, for me... I wasn't affected by it. I would say. so okay of course there was a discourse in the public sphere of political discussions in Greece about... and I can remember some politicians saying that Britain should not leave the, the European Union, for example. um which was nonsense because okay they voted. it was just what they wanted to do so saying after was that...okay so um I mean I think that it was just about ideology, you know? there was no real reason for leaving the European Union. um it just made matters worse regarding um economy, economical relations between Britain and the European countries, countries of the European continent. um so I think it just makes things worse even for the British. so yeah it was a lose-lose situation in the end. I would say. but it's what they wanted. but I won't add, I mean... FOMATPLAY were you surprised about the results of referendum? or somehow did you expect? hmm ANTHANASIOS oh I mean I was thinking that it's going to be a close, a close call. I would say. either for for Brexit either for remain in the European union. um and I think that even the main part is that supported the norm that, that... Britain should remain a member of the European Union. um if I remember right, the word... for example the Labour Party was accused of undercovering, if I'm not mistaken, that it actually wanted Brexit but officially supported to stay. hmm so now, I think that it would be a close call hmm. FOMATPLAY and do you know somebody that somehow has been affected by Brexit? ANTHANASIOS ah yes. I mean when I was in Bochum, uh. there was a professor that; a British professor who had to give a lecture um in Germany and... but he had so many bureaucratic staff to get the passport, all this... and I remember he was telling us that uh he had to pass really strict control, controls in the airport for example even if he was British. I mean, it didn't make much sense but still. he had to... yeah so in this sense yeah it affected the the easiness of travelling and... FOMATPLAY and on the other side; about migration. how do you feel about the attitudes toward migration here in Italy? ANTHANASIOS not very good. I don't think that the italians are very welcoming. but that's not only italians. It is most part... the dominant narrative in European Union. in almost all the countries I think it's the same. we are in danger because of the of migration. we are I will have to protect our borders and, I mean... even in Greece is... that's the the main narrative in the dominant one and I think that's the same also here in Italy from what I have understood so far. um so yeah I don't think that the attitude towards migrants, immigrants is good. is welcoming. I would say. FOMATPLAY do you think it's easy for a migrant coming to Italy to find a job? to Italy or... back to your experiences in Germany? ANTHANASIOS for a migrant not from within the European Union, I guess, but from outside. okay well I think yeah as a European citizen it is easy... is easier to find a job even in Germany or here in Italy. I would say. um but see, it depends. it depends how... on the nationality. because even in Germany if you're a Turkish people, not not a European citizen, but a Turkish citizen; I think it's much easier to find a job because of the Turkish community in Germany um or the Greek one for example in it's really easy to find a job because there is a great-, very large Greek minority. um so yeah I would say it depends. it depends on the nationality, on specific circumstances and even regionally, not nationally not nationally only. yes okay um FOMATPLAY are you planning to... are you active and socially active here in Naples? are you planning to do something? ANTHANASIOS socially active? what do you mean ? FOMATPLAY what did you do here in Naples apart from your Phd? ANTHANASIOS drinking. about, you mean engagement, or? okay, well... I don't have an apartment so I cannot think about anything at the moment because... okay I mean I have asked for, I don't know some kind of communist groups that might be active here in Naples... um yes I have some kind of an idea to get in contact with some people probably. I don't know; some groups yes but for the time being I have done nothing. but I'm planning of course to yeah why not FOMATPLAY yeah, and how, how's your um network of relationships at the moment here? ANTHANASIOS hmm my network I... and yeah okay well so far we have; I have mostly socialized with people from um from SSN um hmm um for brotherhood. uh but no I think that uh so far I have made some really good relationships; and I would say that even for only one month I would consider some of these people as my friends. so from this side um yo I am I'm really happy about it. I'm really really glad that I have made some really good social connections. At the professional level, I mean. FOMATPLAY and what makes you feel you belong to Italy right now? ANTHANASIOS what makes me feel that I belong here? okay well. I would say the proximity of life; way of life, the proximity of.... way of behaviour; of the people...uh even the way even the the way Neapolitans drive; I would say it's something that makes me feel comfortable, like home. eh yes. and of course the working environment that is really good. really open, welcoming um really um not supportive but it helps you, it gives you space to think, to um to discuss, to debate so... yeah all this stuff I think that all this factors make me feel really good here. belonging here yes. FOMATPLAY even though you said that you do not really miss Greece in what sense do you feel attached to Greece? ANTHANASIOS okay. well... mostly people. or solely people. I would say um yeah. mostly my friends, actually. that's my main attachment in Greece and unfortunately my family, my parents, my sister etc. but mostly and mainly my friends. FOMATPLAY what do you miss the most of Greece? just friends? ANTHANASIOS well yes. there is not much to miss from Greece these days. I mean yeah. politically, socially, it's it's a mess. so nothing really except for my friendships. FOMATPLAY okay. and how often are you planning to come back to Greece? ANTHANASIOS mmm it depends. I mean. I don't know um 3 times a year or something like that. during Christmas, Easter or maybe not even that much. haha FOMATPLAY and um what are your experiences with bordering practices? bordering uh experiences so far? ANTHANASIOS no they haven't stopped me anywhere for doing from any kind of control. I have never experienced something like this. I have a friend who, a Greek friend, who had experience... who every time because his girlfriend is in Berlin, for example, and every time he goes to Berlin by plane, the police every time stops him for for a detailed control. FOMATPLAY do you think it's a random thing? ANTHANASIOS no, I think it's a racial thing actually. because he he looks a little bit Arab or something like that... so I think that this is the case. okay okay no no no FOMATPLAY it's perfectly good so I think we can move to the last part of our interview. so I'm going to ask you some short questions and you can answer with short answers or just with one sentence; or just few words; as you wish. so define freedom of moment in one sentence ANTHANASIOS okay um freedom of movement is um the ability to go whenever I want whenever I want wherever I want and in any way that I want. FOMATPLAY and how would you sum up your freedom of movement experience in Europe so far? ANTHANASIOS hmm oh I don't know I mean can you can you please? FOMATPLAY yeah how would you summarize your freedom of movement. a positive experience or? ANTHANASIOS okay oh it's a positive one yes because I mean within the European Union yes. cause I can go with it whenever I want. I mean I can go yeah very easy I can travel very easily. so yes it's positive. I guess FOMATPLAY okay. and how would you feel if your freedom of movement was revoked at some point? was removed at some point? ANTHANASIOS how would I feel? um okay really bad I would say... I mean yeah restriced in a sense. FOMATPLAY and where is home for you? and where do you feel you belong? ANTHANASIOS to the world yeah I mean yeah I don't, I don't think that I belong very specifically somewhere. FOMATPLAY and how do you feel here in Italy? ANTHANASIOS uh really good. really nice experience so far. really welcomed. culturally really close. FOMATPLAY and what do you miss most in your host country? ANTHANASIOS my friends and my family FOMATPLAY would you take the same decision today ANTHANASIOS definitely yes. FOMATPLAY why? ANTHANASIOS why? because I was really consume-... conscious about what I wanted here; what I wanted to find here. so and I think that I found it. I mean it was almost what I expected it to be. so conscious. FOMATPLAY okay. one last question. who are you? and if you could define yourself using just three or four words? ANTHANASIOS okay, three or four words... um joke. um I don't know, intellectual. um friend of communism and... I don't know um Greek European something like that yeah. okay